Salome

 Salome and The Gospel of the Egyptians

Salome is named as one of the female followers of Jesus (Yeshua) in the canonical Gospels, who was present at his crucifixion and more importantly as one of the three female disciples along with Mary Magdalene (Mariam of Magdala) and Joanna, who found his tomb empty. Salome (not to be confused with Salome the daughter of Herod) is identified as the wife of Zebedee, the mother of the Apostles James (the Great) and John. (And in some traditions the older sister of Jesus, or in medieval tradition as the sister of Mary the mother of Jesus). 

Her Importance as a disciple is further stressed in the Apocryphal and Gnostic Gospels were she features often among the 12 Apostles in conversations with Jesus. Including in the now lost 'Gospel according to the Egyptians' known by Apostolic literature to have been one of the earliest Gospels written in Greek in Egypt during the late 1st or early 2nd century CE and used by the Christian Gnostic sects the Naasenes and Sabellians. The Gospel survives today only in quotations by Egyptian Apostolic church father Clement of Alexandria (150 - 215 CE) followed by his own allegorizing interpretions. Salome is also mentioned by Clement as one of the disciples in Jericho in 'The Secret Gospel of Mark,' (another early lost Gospel quoted by Clement), and asks a question to Jesus in 'The Gospel of Thomas,' and in 'Pistis Sophia' along with Mary Magdalene who answers Salomes question with the approval of Jesus.

Salome appers as one of the Hebrew midwives present at the birth of Jesus in various Infancy Gospels including 'The Protoevangelium of James,' 'The Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew' and 'The Latin Infancy Gospel.' Similar to the canonical account of doubting Thomas, she at first does not believe Mary being a virgin has given birth and refuses to believe until she inspects Mary herself. When she inspects Mary her hand immediately becomes disfigured from her lack of faith and she falls to her knees praying to God for forgiveness, when a angel appears and tells her to worship and touch the baby Jesus, which she does and her hand is instantly healed. Later on her journey back home a voice tells her not to talk about the miracles she witnessed until the child enters Jerusalem. 

~the words addressed to Salome which I mentioned earlier. They are handed down, as I believe, in the Gospel of the Egyptians. For they say the Saviour said,

"I have come to undo the works of the female."

by the female meaning lust, and by the works birth and decay.

~Salome asked correctly when the Logos spoke of the end, 

" How long will death prevail?"

 Wherefore the Lord very aptly answered,

"So long as women bear children."

~And why do not they who walk by anything rather than the true rule of the Gospel go on to quote the rest of that which was said to Salome for when she had said, 

"I have done well, then, in not bearing children?,' imagining that it is not permitted to bear children." 

the Lord answers and says,

"Eat of every herb, but the bitter one eat not."

~When Salome inquired when the things concerning which she asked should be known, the Lord said,

"When ye have trampled on the garment of shame, and when the two become one and the male with the female, neither male nor female." 

In the first place, then, we have not this saying in the four Gospels that have been delivered to us, but in that according to the Egyptians.

~For the Lord himself, being asked by someone (Salome) when his Kingdom would come, replied, 

"When two shall be one, that which is without as that which is within, and the male with the female, neither male nor female."

Now, two are one when we speak the truth one to another, and there is unfeignedly one soul in two bodies. And 'that which is without as that which is within,' means this. He calls the soul 'that which is within,' and the body 'that which is without.' As, then, your body is visible to sight, so also let your soul be manifest by good works. And 'the male with the female, neither male or female,' this he said, that brother seeing sister may have no thought concerning her as female, and that she have no thought concerning him as male. 'If you do these things,' he says, 'the Kingdom of my Father shall come.'

-Clement of Alexandria

-The Stromata

~Jesus said, 

"Two will recline on a couch, one will die, one will live."

Salome said, 

"Who are you mister? You have climbed onto my couch and eaten from my table as if you are from someone."

Jesus said to her, 

"I am the one who comes from what is whole. I was granted from the things of my Father."

"I am your disciple."

"For this reason I say, if one is whole, one will be filled with light, but if one is divided, one will be filled with darkness."

-The Gospel of Thomas

~"And he comes into Jericho," the secret Gospel adds only, "And the sister of the youth whom Jesus loved and his mother and Salome were there, and Jesus did not receive them." But many other things about which you wrote both seem to be and are falsifications. Now the true explanation and that which accords with the true philosophy...

-Clement of Alexandria

-The Secret Gospel of Mark

~And when the Saviour had said this, Salome started forward and said, 

"My Lord, if our parents are the rulers, how standeth it written in the Law of Moses, 'He who shall abandon his father and his mother, let him die the death'? Hath not thus the Law made statement thereon?"

And when Salome had said this, the light-power in Mary Magdalene bubbled up in her and she said to the Saviour, 

"My Lord, give commandment unto me that I discourse with my sister Salome to tell her the solution of the word which she hath spoken."

It came to pass then, when the Saviour had heard Mary say these words, that he called her most exceedingly blessed. The Saviour answered and said unto Mary, 

"I give commandment unto thee, Mary, that thou speak the solution of the word which Salome hath spoken."

Mary removeth the doubt of Salome. And when the Saviour had said this, Mary started forward to Salome, embraced her and said unto her, 

"My sister Salome, concerning the word which thou hast spoken, It standeth written in the Law of Moses, 'He who shall abandon his father and his mother, let him die the death,' now, therefore, my sister Salome, the Law hath not said this concerning the soul nor concerning the body nor concerning the counterfeiting spirit, for all these are sons of the rulers and are out of them. But the Law hath said this concerning the power which hath came forth out of the Saviour, and which is the light-man within us today. The Law hath moreover said, Every one who shall remain without the Saviour and all his mysteries, his parents, will not only die the death but go to ruin in destruction."

When then Mary had said this, Salome started forward to Mary and embraced her anew. Salome said, 

"The Saviour hath power to make me understanding like thyself."

-Pistis Sophia

~And the midwife cried out, and said,

"This is a great day to me, because I have seen this strange sight. And the midwife went forth out of the cave, and Salome met her. And she said to her,

"Salome, Salome, I have a strange sight to relate to you, a virgin has brought forth a thing which her nature admits not of."

Then said Salome,

"As the Lord my God lives, unless I thrust in my finger, and search the parts, I will not believe that a virgin has brought forth."

And the midwife went in, and said to Mary, "Show yourself for no small controversy has arisen about you."

And Salome put in her finger, and cried out, and said,

" Woe is me for mine iniquity and mine unbelief, because I have tempted the living God, and, behold, my hand is dropping off as if burned with fire."

And she bent her knees before the Lord, saying, "O God of my fathers, remember that I am the seed of Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, do not make a show of me to the sons of Israel, but restore me to the poor, for You know, O Lord, that in Your name I have performed my services, and that I have received my reward at Your hand." 

And, behold, an angel of the Lord stood by her, saying to her,

"Salome, Salome, the Lord has heard you. Put your hand to the infant, and carry it, and you will have safety and joy." 

And Salome went and carried it, saying,

"I will worship Him, because a great King has been born to Israel." 

And, behold, Salome was immediately cured, and she went forth out of the cave justified. And behold a voice saying,

"Salome, Salome, tell not the strange things you have seen, until the child has come into Jerusalem."

-The Protoevangelium of James

~And Joseph said to the blessed Mary,

"I have brought thee two midwives, Zelomi and Salome and they are standing outside before the entrance to the cave, not daring to come in hither, because of the exceeding brightness. And when the blessed Mary heard this, she smiled and Joseph said to her,

"Do not smile but prudently allow them to visit thee, in case thou shouldst require them for thy cure."

Then she ordered them to enter. And when Zelomi had come in, Salome having stayed without, Zelomi said to Mary,

"Allow me to touch thee."

And when she had permitted her to make an examination, the midwife cried out with a loud voice, and said,

"Lord, Lord Almighty, mercy on us! It has never been heard or thought of, that any one should have her breasts full of milk, and that the birth of a son should show his mother to be a virgin. But there has been no spilling of blood in his birth, no pain in bringing him forth. A virgin has conceived, a virgin has brought forth, and a virgin she remains."

And hearing these words, Salome said,

"Allow me to handle thee, and prove whether Zelomi have spoken the truth."

And the blessed Mary allowed her to handle her. And when she had withdrawn her hand from handling her, it dried up, and through excess of pain she began to weep bitterly, and to be in great distress, crying out, and saying,

"O Lord God, Thou knowest that I have always feared Thee, and that without recompense I have cared for all the poor, I have taken nothing from the widow and the orphan, and the needy have I not sent empty away. And, behold, I am made wretched because of mine unbelief, since without a cause I wished to try Thy virgin."

And while she was thus speaking, there stood by her a young man in shining garments, saying, 

"Go to the child, and adore Him, and touch Him with thy hand, and He will heal thee, because He is the Saviour of the world, and of all that hope in Him."

And she went to the child with haste, and adored Him, and touched the fringe of the cloths in which He was wrapped, and instantly her hand was cured. And going forth, she began to cry aloud, and to tell the wonderful things which she had seen, and which she had suffered, and how she had been cured, so that many through her statements believed.

-The Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew

The Difference Between Gnosis and Epignosis?

 The Difference Between Gnosis and Epignosis?

As far as the words are concerned, they are both Greek nouns commonly translated “knowledge," gnosis and epignosis.

Both are related to the verb ginosko, which means “know; understand; perceive.” The way this verb is used in the Bible, though, shows that it can indicate a favorable relationship between the person and one he “knows.” (1Co 8:3; 2Ti 2:19) Knowledge (gnosis) is put in a very favorable light in the New Testament. 

For example, Peter exhorts us to "grow in knowledge" (2 Pet. 1:5-6), and the word is "gnosis". He assures us that if we follow his advice we will be "neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ" (v. 8). But in this statement the word is "epignosis", and similar comparisons will be found elsewhere. The question is; What is the significance of these two words? And if we have "gnosis" (knowledge), when can we claim to have "epignosis" (deeper knowledge)?

Both words are derived from the verb "ginosko" which signifies the act of taking in knowledge, in such a way as to establish a relationship between the one knowing and the object known. For example: "This is life eternal to know (ginosko) Thee, the only true God and Jesus whom Thou hast sent" (John 17:3).

In such a context, the verb implies the one knowing, and not merely an academic knowledge.

When the preposition "epi" is added to the noun or verb, transforming it into "epignosis" or "epignosko", it suggests a fuller knowledge or recognition of the object known. Hence the question posed us: When does one reach "gnosis" to move on to "epignosis"?

The answer, of course, is a matter of interpretation. Our opinion is that "epignosis" does not indicate an increased quantity of knowledge, but a fuller quality of it. "Epignosis" is the absorbing and manifesting of whatever knowledge the capacity of the individual permits him to absorb.

And capacity varies with the individual. Christ declared: "Unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required" (Luke 13:48). The liquid capacity of a glass may be half a pint or litre, and when that amount is poured into it, it has reached its full capacity. It would be folly, wasteful, and perhaps disastrous to try and pour two litres of liquid into it. So with ourselves. When we have reached full capacity according to our limited ability and are using that knowledge effectively, we have "epignosis"; even though our grasp of a subject is more limited than that of others.

However, not all that men may call “knowledge” is to be sought, because philosophies and views exist that are “falsely called ‘knowledge.’” (1Ti 6:20) The recommended knowledge is about God and his purposes. (2Pe 1:5) This involves more than merely having facts, which many atheists have; a personal devotion to God and Christ is implied. (Joh 17:3; 6:68, 69) Whereas having knowledge (information alone) might result in a feeling of superiority, our knowing “the love of the Christ which surpasses knowledge,” that is, knowing this love by experience because we are personally imitating his loving ways, will balance and give wholesome direction to our use of any information we may have gained.—Eph 3:19.

Epignosis, a strengthened form of gno´sis (epi´, meaning "deeper" or “additional”), can often be seen from the context to mean “exact, accurate, or full knowledge.” Thus Paul wrote about some who were learning (taking in knowledge) “yet never able to come to an accurate knowledge [“a real knowledge,” TC; “a personal knowledge,” Ro; “clear, full knowledge,” Da ftn] of truth.” (2Ti 3:6, 7) He also prayed that ones in the Colossian congregation, who obviously had some knowledge of God’s will, for they had become Christians, “be filled with the accurate knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual comprehension.” (Col 1:9) Such accurate knowledge should be sought by all Christians (Eph 1:15-17; Php 1:9; 1Ti 2:3, 4), it being important in putting on “the new personality” and in gaining peace.—Col 3:10; 2Pe 1:2.

"Epignosis" is full-knowledge, or the fulness of knowledge. It is applying the substance of knowledge. Like ordinary food, it is not the quantity that we take in that counts, but the absorption by the body of the goodness of that which we consume, and which contributes to physical growth.

Consider the basic doctrine that God is one, and that we should "love Him" with all our strength. If we love a person sufficiently, we will enjoy being in his company, and we will extol his virtues to others. We will be anxious that he is well-respected by our acquaintances, and to that end we will introduce him to others, so that they may share our pleasure. Moreover, if our love is real, we will be longing and yearning after his presence, and moulding our lives so that we may appear attractive to him. So with the love of God. A person who truly loves God will yearn for fellowship with Him. He will strive to reach His holiness, knowing that it will please Him, in the same manner as he would pursue any object for which he feels a strong passion. He will find pleasure in studying the things relating to His majesty and purpose, in uttering words of praise to His name; and in occupying himself with the messages he has received from Him for his benefit and guidance. His feelings towards God will be like those of a lover towards the wife of his youth, or those of a father towards his child.

History of Gnosticism

A history graph over Gnosticism. Note that neo-Gnosticism was essentially started up in the 19th century, generally keeping some of the false narratives of the Church Fathers when designing their theology. The Nag Hammadi Library was hidden in the desert in the 4th or 5th century. The Cathars that were Paulician (or perhaps Marcionite), rather than Gnostic, went extinct in the 13th century. Qabbalah was written down in the 11th century. The last Manichaeans disappeared some time after the 13th century but before the 18th century in China. The Mandeans are the only ones that have a real Gnostic heritage, but they will not accept converts. I suspect the first real Gnostics preceeded Jesus and John the Baptist. #gnosticdoctrine #gnosticteachings

 

Jesus and Satan

Good and bad, wrong and right. Love and hate, joy and suffering.

Duality is the crux of human being. The physical plane provides a canvas of contrast.

This is suitable for the mind's need to understand and define. Or the mind found suit in this paradigm.

Egg meet Chicken 🧠🥚🐔

Take a Divine step back, detaching from self interest and cognitive frameworks. See the Singularity that exists in totality.

Up implies down. Happy needs sad  ☯️

Reconforming then creates a clear understanding that we are the Creator of *our* existence, perception, and fate. We are subject to circumstances, but these evolve through our response.

All forms of Dieties and Spirit exist because we are interdimensional. But they are not us, nor do they control us. We as Light Beings maintain a power of presence that can always transcend. 

Pick your potion: subject to change 😊🌊♾

Namaste  🙏💖🕉

 

How to Reset Your Life

 How to Reset Your Life 

Reset your self get back on track 

Empathy Plato

 So many forget that whole suspension of ego part when trying to empathize with others

We must dream to change how man measures the needs of humanity.~GEG

The Mind of Christ

 

Gnostic Teaching on Purgatory

Traditional Gnostic Teaching on Purgatory 

Is there a purgatory ? 

And if so, can the priest by his masses bring the faithful out of it ?''

The Roman Catholic Church teaches that the undying souls of men leave their bodies at death. The wicked (those who die in mortal sin) go to hell for eternal torment. The righteous, dying with unforgiven venial sin or undischarged temporal punishment, go to a painful purification before being fit for heaven.

Purgatory is a half-way house between 'heaven' and 'hell'. The Roman Catholic church teaches that Purgatory is a place of purging, in which the soul will suffer for a while before being fit to gain salvation in heaven. The prayers, candle-burning and financial gifts to the church of a person and his friends is supposed to shorten the length of time that the soul suffers in 'purgatory'.

The word Purgatory is not used in the Bible nor the nag hammadi texts 

Gnostic sects like the Bogomils, Pauliciani, Cathars rejected the doctrine of Purgatory

Ralph of Coggeshale goes into considerable detail of the doctrines of the Pauliciani in Flanders and England, and thereby establishes their complete identity with the Bogomils. They held, he says, to two principles-of good and evil; they rejected purgatory, prayers for the dead, the invocation of saints, infant baptism, and the use of pictures, images, and crucifixes in the churches ;

The Albigenses (also known as Cathari), named after the town of Albi, where they had many followers. They had their own celibate clergy class, who expected to be greeted with reverence. They believed that Jesus spoke figuratively in his last supper when he said of the bread, “This is my body.” (Matthew 26:26, NAB) They rejected the doctrines of the Trinity, the Virgin Birth, hellfire, and purgatory. Thus they actively put in doubt the teachings of Rome. Pope Innocent III gave instructions that the Albigenses be persecuted. “If necessary,” he said, “suppress them with the sword.” 

Protestants, like Cathars, rejected the medieval Roman doctrine of transubstantiation and infant baptism. Like Cathars and Waldensians, Protestant Churches encourage laymen to read the scriptures for themselves. Most accept women as ministers, and most affirm the dignity of labour. Churchmen themselves are increasingly working for a living rather than living off tithes. Protestant theology is that of mitigated dualism, embracing predestination and rejecting the Catholic position on Free Will. Protestants, like Cathars, reject the medieval Roman Catholic notion of Purgatory, along with the practice of praying for the dead, and the entire system of indulgences.

The Jews had originally had no concept of an afterlife, but under Greek influence they had developed an ill-defined belief in an afterlife by the time of Jesus Christ. (The words translated as hell in the Old Testament actually mean grave or rubbish-tip). In the 2nd Century BCE the Jews had developed a  belief that there was a afterlife in heaven or hell. Ideas such as Purgatory and Limbo were developed much later. More conservative Jews at the time of Jesus still held ideas of an afterlife to be an offensive novelty. As they pointed out the many punishments promised by God in scripture are all punishments in this world. None is promised for an afterlife.

Man has conceived that there is such a condition as life separate from God, and obedient to man’s thought; he has produced such a state of mind. When man changes his mind he will find that he lives in heaven continually, but by the power of his thought has made all kinds of places: earth, purgatory, heaven, hell and numerous intermediate states

The righteous are never promised salvation in heaven. The granting of salvation will be at the judgment seat at Christ's return, rather than at some time after death when we supposedly leave 'purgatory' (Matt. 25:31-34; Rev. 22:12).

All the righteous receive their rewards at the same time, rather than each person gaining salvation at different times (Heb. 11:39,40; 2 Tim. 4:8).

Death is followed by complete unconsciousness, rather than the activities suggested by the doctrine of purgatory.

We are purged from our sins through baptism into Christ and developing a firm faith in his work during our present life, rather than through some period of suffering after death. We are told to "purge out therefore the old leaven" of sin in our lives (1 Cor. 5:7); to purge ourselves from the works of sin (2 Tim. 2:21; Heb. 9:14). Our time of purging is therefore now, in this life, rather than in a place of purging ('purgatory') which we enter after death. "Now is the day of salvation...now is the accepted time" (2 Cor. 6:2). Our obedience to God in baptism and development of a spiritual character in this life, will lead to our salvation (Gal. 6:8) - not to the spending of a period in 'purgatory'.

The efforts of others to save us through candle-burning and other donations to the Catholic church, will not affect our salvation at all. "They that trust in their wealth...none of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him...that he should still live for ever" (Ps. 49:6-9).

God has Breasts El Shaddai

 The Breasts of the Father Ode 19

In this study we will look at the feminine aspects of God but first we will start with an opening reading from the Odes of Solomon Ode 19:

Ode 19 
A cup of milk was offered to me, and I drank it in the sweetness of the Lord's kindness. 
The Son is the cup, and the Father is He who was milked; and the Holy Spirit is She who milked Him; 
Because His breasts were full, and it was undesirable that His milk should be ineffectually released. 
The Holy Spirit opened Her bosom, and mixed the milk of the two breasts of the Father. 
Then She gave the mixture to the generation without their knowing, and those who have received it are in the perfection of the right hand. 
The womb of the Virgin took it, and she received conception and gave birth. 
So the Virgin became a mother with great mercies. 
And she labored and bore the Son but without pain, because it did not occur without purpose. 
And she did not require a midwife, because He caused her to give life. 
She brought forth like a strong man with desire, and she bore according to the manifestation, and she acquired according to the Great Power. 
And she loved with redemption, and guarded with kindness, and declared with grandeur.
Hallelujah. 

Early Church Fathers' Understanding of God Having Breasts

The notion that God, or the Father, possesses feminine breasts may initially seem startling or unorthodox, yet it emerges within the early Christian writings as a profound theological metaphor. Early church fathers, particularly Irenæus of Lyons and Clement of Alexandria, frequently employed such imagery to express divine nurturing and life-giving attributes, often symbolizing the intimate relationship between God and humanity. This metaphorical understanding is rooted in the concept of God as both masculine and feminine, emphasizing the inclusive nature of divine care.

Irenæus, the bishop of Lyons in the late second century, is one of the earliest church fathers to employ this imagery. In his seminal work Against Heresies (ca. 180 CE), he speaks of the nurturing role of God, comparing divine sustenance to the act of a mother nursing her children. Irenæus writes, "Those who do not have a share in the Spirit are not nourished to life by the Mother's breasts" (Irenæus, Against Heresies, book 3, chapter 24:1). Here, the metaphor of the "Mother's breasts" refers to the nurturing aspect of the Spirit, which sustains and nourishes believers to spiritual life. This imagery is aligned with the broader Christian tradition of depicting God as a source of life and care, invoking maternal imagery to underscore the divine's role in spiritual rebirth.

Clement of Alexandria, another significant early church figure, is perhaps best known for his rich theological metaphors that portray God in both masculine and feminine terms. Clement, who flourished in the late second and early third centuries, frequently utilized the imagery of nurturing and mothering to describe the relationship between God and humanity. In his work Exhortation to the Greeks and other writings, he characterizes the divine Logos (Word) as a nourishing force, likening it to a mother who feeds her child. Clement writes, "The Word is everything to the child, both father and mother, teacher and nurse . . . The nutriment is the milk of the Father . . . and the Word alone supplies us children with the milk of love, and only those who suck at this breast are truly happy." (Clement of Alexandria, Exhortation to the Greeks).

For Clement, the "milk of the Father" is a symbol of the divine Word, which sustains and nourishes the soul. The act of "sucking" or "seeking" the Word is likened to a child feeding at the breast, an intimate act of reception and growth. This maternal metaphor aligns with the Christian understanding of salvation as a nurturing and life-giving process, where God, as both Father and Mother, provides the sustenance needed for spiritual growth.

Elaine Pagels, a renowned scholar of early Christianity, highlights the theological significance of Clement's use of maternal imagery. She notes that for Clement, "the Word alone supplies us children with the milk of love," presenting God as both a nurturing mother and a guiding father. The dual nature of God, encompassing both masculine and feminine qualities, is a recurring theme in Clement's thought, reflecting the early church's complex and evolving understanding of the divine. Pagels points out that, "seeking is called sucking; to those infants who seek the Word, the Father's loving breasts supply milk." This comparison underscores the tender and nourishing aspects of divine love, which are accessible to all believers who seek the Word in humility and faith.

Moreover, the metaphor of divine breasts in early Christian thought can be traced to the Old Testament, where God is sometimes portrayed in maternal terms. The Hebrew name El Shaddai, often translated as "God Almighty," is etymologically linked to the word "Shadd," which means "breast." This connection suggests that the biblical understanding of God includes an aspect of maternal care and sustenance, a theme that early Christian writers like Irenæus and Clement would later draw upon to express the fullness of God's nature.

Jerome, another prominent church father, acknowledged the complexity of gendered language in relation to the divine. In his commentary on the Bible, Jerome famously noted that "the word for Spirit is feminine in Hebrew, masculine in Latin, and neuter in Greek," reflecting the diversity of ways in which the divine Spirit was understood in different cultural and linguistic contexts. Jerome's observation indicates that debates surrounding the gendered language of God were taking place within the early church, particularly regarding the use of feminine language for the Spirit. While Jerome maintained that God transcends gender, his remarks suggest an awareness of the theological implications of feminine imagery in relation to the divine.

In conclusion, the use of maternal imagery to describe God, including the metaphor of divine breasts, is not a foreign or isolated concept within early Christian thought. Church fathers like Irenæus and Clement of Alexandria utilized this imagery to express the nurturing and life-giving aspects of God’s nature. By portraying God as both Father and Mother, they sought to convey the fullness of divine care and love, emphasizing God’s intimate relationship with humanity. This theological perspective, enriched by biblical tradition and the linguistic flexibility of early Christian writers, underscores the depth and complexity of the early church’s understanding of the divine..

**Shaddai and the Breasts of God**

The idea that God has breasts may sound surprising or even radical today, but it arises directly from ancient Hebrew language, biblical imagery, and early Jewish and Christian theological reflection. One of the key places this concept appears is in the name **El Shaddai**, a title for God in the Hebrew Bible, and its ancient etymological connections.

### The Meaning of El Shaddai

The main Hebrew lexicons, *Brown-Driver-Briggs* (BDB) and *The Hebrew and Aramaic Lexicon of the Old Testament* (HALOT, also known as K-B for its editors Kohler and Baumgartner), offer various possibilities for the etymology of the word **Shaddai**. One suggestion is that it derives from the verb **שדד shadad**, meaning “to deal violently with,” but none of these sources suggest that **Shaddai** means “God of violence.” Another possibility listed in BDB is that it comes from **שדה shadah**, meaning “to pour out,” referring to God as “rain giver.” 

The *Kohler-Baumgartner lexicon (HALOT)* suggests that the word could be based on the **Akkadian shadu**, meaning “mountain.” Thus, **El Shaddai** would mean “The God of the Mountain(s).” This is the prevailing scholarly consensus today. HALOT also notes other suggestions, including the idea that **Shaddai** refers to one of the ancestral gods, though the exact meaning remains uncertain.

However, one compelling possibility not noted in BDB or HALOT but found in both *Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament (TDOT)* and *New International Dictionary of Old Testament Theology and Exegesis (NIDOTTE)* is that **Shaddai** comes from **שד shad**, the Hebrew word for “breast.” In Hebrew, the word **שד shad** means “breast,” and although the noun is masculine in form, it refers specifically to female breasts.

TDOT observes that **Shaddai** follows a pattern of divine names that pair a natural element with an adjectival suffix. TDOT mentions:  

> “One thinks of ‘Artsay, Tallay, and Pidray, wives of Ba`al, whose names mean ‘One of the Earth,’ ‘The Dewy One,’ and ‘The Misty One.’” (TDOT, I:256)  

Thus, **Shaddai** would naturally mean “The Breasted One.”

Although TDOT ultimately favors the interpretation “God of the Mountain,” it acknowledges “The God of Breasts” as a meaningful and significant alternative.  

TDOT notes:  

> “Despite several attempted and suggested explanations the etymology of שדי has still not been completely clarified.” (TDOT, I:257)

This ambiguity should caution against dismissing the “God of Breasts” interpretation simply because of later scholarly trends toward “God of the Mountain(s).”

### El Shaddai — The Strong Breasted One

The title **El Shaddai** can be literally understood as “The Strong Breasted One.” This maternal imagery is deeply linked to ideas of sustenance, provision, and intimate care, much like a mother nourishing her child.

The Hebrew Bible portrays God under this name as a Provider and Sustainer. God introduced Himself to Abraham saying:  

> “I am El Shaddai; walk before me and be blameless.” (Genesis 17:1)

In Deuteronomy, we read:  

> “He found him in a desert land, and in the howling waste of the wilderness; He encircled him, He cared for him, He guarded him as the pupil of His eye.” (Deut. 32:10)

These nurturing qualities resonate with the image of God having life-giving, sustaining “breasts.”

### Early Jewish Interpretation — Shaddai the All-Sufficer

Early Jewish thinkers often associated **Shaddai** with sufficiency and nourishment. El Shaddai was the “All-Sufficer,” the One who nourishes and sustains like a mother caring for her children.

Philo of Alexandria, a Hellenistic Jewish philosopher, linked the name **Shaddai** with sufficiency:  

> “The name Shaddai signifies ‘one who is sufficient,’ meaning that God stands in need of nothing.” (*On the Change of Names* 5:23)

This echoes the idea of maternal abundance and provision, associating God’s sufficiency with nourishment.

### The Dual Nature of God — Father and Mother

Early Christians extended this imagery to describe God’s dual nature as both Father and Mother. The name **El Shaddai** hints at this duality. In its original Hebrew form:

- **El** means “God” or “Strength.”

- **Shaddai**, derived from **shad**, means “breast” — feminine and nurturing.

Some early Christian thinkers saw this as reflecting the unity of masculine and feminine within the Deity. The duality is beautifully expressed in *Genesis*:

> “So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created He him; male and female created He them.” (Genesis 1:27)

This indicates that both male and female characteristics are found in the image of God — a reflection of both strength and nurturing.

### Clement of Alexandria on the Breasts of God

Clement of Alexandria is one of the most explicit early Church Fathers using maternal imagery for God. In his *Paedagogus*, Clement writes:  

> “The Word is everything to the child, both father and mother, teacher and nurse… The nutriment is the milk of the Father… and the Word alone supplies us children with the milk of love, and only those who suck at this breast are truly happy. For this reason, seeking is called sucking; to those infants who seek the Word, the Father's loving breasts supply milk.” (Paedagogus 1.6)

This passage illustrates how Clement envisions the Divine as possessing metaphorical breasts — nourishing believers with spiritual milk.

### Conclusion

Though the etymology of **El Shaddai** remains debated, the ancient possibility of it meaning **“The Breasted One”** is supported by Hebrew linguistics and early theological interpretation. This title highlights God’s nurturing, maternal aspects alongside strength and power. Far from being shocking, the image of God as possessing life-giving, sustaining breasts was meaningful to ancient Jewish and Christian thinkers alike, reflecting a more complete, encompassing image of the Divine.

The Breasts of the Father and Christ: Nurturing Divine Sustenance and Motherhood

The concept of divine nourishment in Christian esoteric thought is often portrayed through maternal imagery, especially in the context of Christ and the Father. The symbolism of breasts as sources of milk represents spiritual sustenance and care. The Odes of Solomon, an early Christian hymn collection, provides profound insights into the maternal and nurturing aspects of both Christ and the Father. These hymns articulate divine motherhood through imagery of the Father’s breasts and Christ’s role as the provider of spiritual nourishment. In this exploration, we will examine how these maternal symbols reflect the nurturing nature of Christ and the Father, and their connection to the Church, seen in passages like Ode 8 and Ode 19.

Christ as Mother in Ode 8

One of the most striking examples of Christ depicted as a mother appears in Ode 8: “My own breasts did I prepare for them” (8:14). In this verse, Christ is not only the giver of life but also the maternal provider of milk, which sustains the faithful. The idea of Christ as the nursing mother is a radical departure from traditional representations of God as exclusively paternal, emphasizing a nurturing, feminine role. The verse continues: “I fashioned their limbs / and my own breasts I prepared for them / that they might drink my holy milk and live by it.” This passage envisions Christ not only as a father figure but as one who cares for His followers in the most intimate and nurturing way, offering life-sustaining nourishment.

This maternal image is reinforced by the contrast between the physical nourishment of milk and its spiritual parallel: just as a mother’s milk nourishes the infant body, Christ’s spiritual nourishment sustains the soul. The faithful, drinking from Christ's milk, are imbued with life, symbolizing the life-giving relationship between Christ and His followers. The image of the divine as a mother providing for the people reflects both a compassionate and intimate relationship with humanity.

The Father as Source of Nourishment in Ode 19

In Ode 19, we encounter an even more striking portrayal of the Father as a nurturing figure. The text reads: "The Son is the cup, and the Father is He who was milked; and the Holy Spirit is She who milked Him; Because His breasts were full, and it was undesirable that His milk should be ineffectually released" (Ode 19:2). In this passage, the Father is described as having “breasts,” an image traditionally associated with femininity. The Father, often depicted in masculine terms in Scripture, is here portrayed in a wholly feminine light. This reversal of typical gender roles emphasizes the fullness of divine nurturing and care, further complicated by the Holy Spirit’s role in “milking” the Father, symbolizing her action of distributing divine sustenance.

The metaphor of divine milk being "ineffectively released" suggests that God’s nurturing energy must be properly channeled, ensuring that it reaches the people in a life-giving manner. This imagery of the Father as the milked one, the Son as the cup, and the Holy Spirit as the one who milks points to a harmonious, triune action that nourishes the faithful, further highlighting the maternal role within the divine relationship.

The Virgin as the Church in Ode 19

Another significant aspect of Ode 19 is the imagery of the Virgin. The Virgin is described as “becoming a Mother” and “laboring and bearing the Son but without pain, because it did not occur without purpose” (Ode 19:6). In this context, the Virgin is not referring to Mary, but rather to the Church, which is often symbolized as a virgin in Christian esoteric thought. 2 Corinthians 11:2 states: "For I am jealous for you with godly jealousy. For I have betrothed you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ," emphasizing the purity and sanctity of the Church, the Bride of Christ.

Similarly, Ephesians 5:27 speaks of the Church as a “glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish,” reinforcing the idea that the Church is the Virgin that receives and nurtures the divine. Galatians 4:26 further adds, "Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all," symbolizing the heavenly, nurturing aspect of the Church as the mother of all believers. The Church, as the Virgin, receives the milk of divine sustenance and gives birth to spiritual life.

The Breasts of the Father as a Source of Spiritual Life

The Odes of Solomon make repeated references to the "milk" of the Father and the role of the Father’s "breasts" in the nourishment of the faithful. Ode 19 highlights this: “the milk from the two breasts of the Father” (Ode 19:4). The Father, traditionally envisioned as a powerful, authoritative figure, is here portrayed as a source of maternal care, providing spiritual sustenance through His “breasts.” The use of feminine imagery to describe the Father does not diminish His role as the Creator but rather expands the understanding of His nature to include both masculine and feminine aspects.

This imagery finds its roots in Old Testament metaphors of God as a nurturing figure. Psalm 22:9-10 portrays God as a midwife, taking a maternal role in the formation of the believer: “Yet You are He who took me out of the womb; You made me trust while on my mother’s breasts.” Similarly, Isaiah 49:15 and Isaiah 66:13 depict God as a comforting mother, nurturing and caring for His people. In Isaiah 42:14b, God is described as “travailing in the throes of divine labor pangs,” a vivid metaphor for God’s active participation in the birthing of new life, further emphasizing the maternal aspects of His nature.

Conclusion

The imagery of divine breasts and milk in the Odes of Solomon provides a profound theological vision of God as both Father and Mother, embodying a fullness of care and nurturing that transcends traditional gender roles. Christ, portrayed as a nursing mother in Ode 8, provides spiritual nourishment, while the Father, in Ode 19, is depicted with maternal breasts that sustain the faithful. The Virgin, symbolizing the Church, receives this divine milk and gives birth to new spiritual life. This rich imagery serves to deepen our understanding of the divine nature as one that is both strong and nurturing, offering life and sustenance to all who seek it. Through these poetic and symbolic representations, we encounter a more holistic vision of God’s love, care, and provision for His people.

Medieval Christian Mystics 

In exploring the maternal imagery in Christian theology, particularly the representation of Christ as both a father and a mother, we find numerous historical figures and writings that echo this theme. From medieval mystics to monastic teachings, the concept of divine motherly affection, nourishment, and protection takes center stage, offering a powerful understanding of divine love and care for humanity.

Bernard of Clairvaux (1090-1153), a Cistercian monk, powerfully conveyed the need for spiritual leaders to embody both paternal authority and maternal tenderness. In his sermon to prelates, Bernard emphasizes the dual role of a leader: “Show affection as a mother would, correct like a father. Be gentle, avoid harshness, do not resort to blows, expose your breasts: let your bosoms swell with milk, not swell with passion.” This passage highlights the importance of gentle, nurturing care—representing the motherly aspect of Christ—while still maintaining the necessary discipline of a father. The metaphor of exposing one’s breasts and allowing the bosom to swell with milk emphasizes the nourishment and comfort leaders must provide to their spiritual charges. Furthermore, Bernard asks, “Why will the young man, bitten by the serpent, shy away from the judgment of the priest, to whom he ought to run as to the bosom of a mother?” This question illustrates how a priest, like Christ, is called to be a refuge, a nurturing presence, offering spiritual sustenance as a mother would to her child.

Similarly, Guerric of Igny, another Cistercian, reflects on Christ’s dual role as both father and mother. He writes, “Christ is a father in virtue of natural creation ... and authority. ... He is a mother too in the mildness of his affection, and a nurse. ... The Holy Spirit (is) like milk poured out from Christ's own breasts.” Here, Guerric acknowledges Christ’s nurturing role, comparing the Holy Spirit’s role to the milk that is poured out from the breasts of Christ. This divine nourishment is not only a sign of maternal affection but also a symbol of the life-giving and sustaining power of the divine.

In Clare of Assisi's vision, she experiences a deeply personal and spiritual encounter with St. Francis, which evokes the imagery of Christ as a mother. In her dream, “St. Francis bared his breast, saying ‘Come, take and drink.’ And she did so. Then St. Francis bid her suckle a second time.” The sweetness and delight Clare experiences in this vision further deepens the maternal metaphor, as she feels spiritually nourished by the divine presence. After the experience, she describes the nipple of the breast remaining between her lips, and what she finds in her mouth is "pure shining gold." The image of gold here symbolizes the purity and preciousness of the divine milk that Clare receives, reinforcing the notion of spiritual nourishment that transcends mere physical sustenance.

Catherine of Siena (1347-1380) also wrote about this intimate relationship with the divine through the imagery of Christ's milk. In her work, she reflects, “...the soul who has in truth entered the house of self-knowledge ... receives me, through affection of love, seeking to draw herself the milk of my sweetness from the breast of the doctrine of Christ crucified.” For Catherine, the “milk of sweetness” signifies the profound spiritual nourishment that comes from understanding and uniting with Christ’s sacrifice. She elaborates in another passage, describing how the soul “reposes on the breast of my divine charity, keeping in the mouth of holy desire the flesh of Christ crucified, ... the soul reposes at the breast of Christ crucified, who is the Truth, and thus draws to herself the milk of virtue.” Catherine’s writings depict a nurturing Christ who offers His milk as a source of spiritual life and sustenance, drawing those who approach Him into an intimate union.

In Julian of Norwich (1342-1413+), the image of Christ as a mother reaches its zenith. She writes, “Jesus is our true Mother in nature by our first Creation, and he is our true Mother in grace by his taking our created Nature.” Julian sees Christ not only as the nurturing mother who cares for us with tenderness but also as the mother who feeds us with His own flesh. She writes, “The mother can give her child suck of her milk, but our precious Mother Jesus can feed us with himself, and does most courteously and most tenderly with the blessed sacrament, which is the precious food of true life.” The motherly imagery of Christ feeding His children with Himself underscores the deep bond between Christ and the believer, one of complete self-giving and love.

In Christian folklore, the maternal imagery extends into stories of saints, such as St. Agatha, whose breasts were tortured during her martyrdom. Yet, she responded, “Know that in my soul I have other breasts, whose milk sustains all of my senses, which I have long since dedicated to God!” This powerful statement highlights how the nourishment of the soul transcends physical suffering. Agatha’s declaration of spiritual breasts points to the idea of divine sustenance available to the soul, independent of earthly tribulations.

The Golden Legend by Jacobus de Voragine also includes a story about a woman martyr who, while suffering, continued to feed her children with “the sweetness of thy milk,” even as her flesh was torn. The miracle that followed—milk spurted forth from her wounds instead of blood—reinforces the symbolism of the spiritual nourishment that martyrs offer through their suffering.

Finally, the life of St. Bernard’s mother illustrates the maternal role of virtue and devotion. Bernard's mother, who bore seven children, is said to have imparted to her children “the nature of their mother's virtue” through her milk. This story links maternal love with moral and spiritual development, where the physical act of nursing becomes a metaphor for the transmission of virtue and devotion to God.

In all these accounts, the metaphor of divine milk and breasts serves as a rich image of nurturing, spiritual nourishment, and affection. Whether through the writings of mystics like Bernard, Guerric, and Catherine, or through visions like those of Clare and Julian, the figure of Christ as both Father and Mother offers profound insights into the divine care and affection that believers experience in their relationship with the sacred. These maternal images remind us that divine love is both a source of authority and of intimate, tender care, providing believers with the nourishment necessary for spiritual growth and salvation.

The Shakers

Shaker theology is based on the idea of the dualism of God as male and female: "So God created him; male and female he created them" (Genesis 1:27). This passage was interpreted as showing the dual nature of the Creator

An all-important, sublime, and foundational doctrine of the Shakers is the Existence of an Eternal Father and an Eternal Mother in Deity — the Heavenly Parents of all angelical and human beings.


31. As Father, God is the infinite Fountain of intelligence, and the Source of all power — "the Almighty, great and terrible in majesty;" "the high and lofty One, that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy, dwelling in the high and holy place;" and "a consuming fire." 

32. But, as Mother, "God is love" and tenderness! If all the maternal affections of all the female or bearing spirits in animated nature were combined together, and then concentered in one individual human female, that person would be but as a type or image of our Eternal Heavenly Mother. 

The Gnostic Gospels Illuminated by Cyd Ropp

 The Gnostic Gospels Illuminated by Cyd Ropp 

Fishes - 153 of them (John 21:11)

Fishes - 153 of them (John 21:11)

A fishing party, which included the present writer, once caught in a fairly short time off the coast of British Columbia, six splendid salmon. Their total weight was sixty-three pounds. If the "great fishes" caught in Galilee were on a par with these, this would make the total catch now under consideration to be about three-quarters of a ton.

But why — the question may well be asked — was John so careful as to specify meticulously how many fish were caught? At different times thousands of his readers have scented a special significance here. There is a sound instinct behind this.

Here, then, is a list of suggestions (doubtless incomplete). Some of these have a good Biblical flavour; others not at all.

1.	153 = 9x17: and 9 is the number of judgment (is it?), whilst 17 combines the ideas of "spirit" and "order": 10 + 7 (do they?). So it is said! (Companion Bible).
2.	There were not 153 fishes, but 154—and this is 11 x 14 (or 22 x 7), again with corresponding numerical meaning. Sic!
3.	Contemporary Greek zoologists asserted that the sea contains precisely 153 different species of fishes. So John saw this number as symbolizing men out of all nations within the gospel net (Hoskyns).
4.	By Gematria (that is, substituting the numerical value of each letter), the Greek word for "fishes' (ichthues) gives 1224 which is 153 x 8. Thus, "fishes" suggests those caught in the gospel net according to the eighth sign.
5.	When "Sons of God" is written in Hebrew characters it gives, by Gematria once again (par.4): 153. This result only holds true, however, if the Hebrew definite article is included: B'nei ha-Elohim, which could signify: Sons (disciples, converts) of the Mighty (the Apostles), that is, the fruits of their preaching.
6.	2 Chronicles 2:17 gives 153 thousand and six hundred as the number of "strangers", i.e. Gentiles, in Israel who were numbered by David. And in Exodus 30:14-16, numbering of the people is associated with atonement and redemption.
7.	And now, mathematics. For the reason made plain by this diagram, 10 is called a triangular number 4.
	* ** *** ****
	The next in the set is, of course, 15; and then 21, and so on.
	153 is one of this family. 153 = triangular number 17.
	Similarly, 120 (Acts 1:15) = triangular number 15 (and 15 = triangular number 5).
	276 (Acts 27:37) = triangular number 23.
	666 (Rev. 13:18) = triangular number 36 (and 36 = triangular number 8).
	These are the most noteworthy, but not the only, examples to be found in the NT The odds against all the three-figure numbers in the NT being "triangular" are enormous. Has such a thing happened by "chance"? So it looks as though the early church saw special meaning in the idea of triangular numbers. But what? Possibly, but not certainly, according to Matthew 28:19, thus:
			Father
			/	\
		Son		Holy Spirit
	There may be some other more satisfactory explanation of 153 outside the range of the seven suggestions listed here. But it is not necessary to believe that the eighth sign has eight different meanings. Studies in the Gospels. By Harry Whittaker

The Preexistence of the Son of Man in the book of Enoch

 The Preexistence of the Son of Man in the book of Enoch 

In this study we will look at the Preexistence of the son of man in the book of Enoch to begin we will have an opening reading from the book of Enoch Chapter 46:

1 And there I saw One who had a head of days,
And His head was white like wool,
And with Him was another being whose countenance had the appearance of a man,
And his face was full of graciousness, like one of the holy angels.
2 And I asked the angel who went with me and showed me all the hidden things, concerning that
3 Son of Man, who he was, and whence he was, (and) why he went with the Head of Days? And he answered and said unto me:
This is the son of Man who hath righteousness,
With whom dwelleth righteousness,
And who revealeth all the treasures of that which is hidden,
Because the Lord of Spirits hath chosen him,
And whose lot hath the pre-eminence before the Lord of Spirits in uprightness for ever.
4 And this Son of Man whom thou hast seen
Shall raise up the kings and the mighty from their seats,
[And the strong from their thrones]
And shall loosen the reins of the strong,
And break the teeth of the sinners.
5 [And he shall put down the kings from their thrones and kingdoms]
Because they do not extol and praise Him,
Nor humbly acknowledge whence the kingdom was bestowed upon them.
6 And he shall put down the countenance of the strong,
And shall fill them with shame.
And darkness shall be their dwelling,
And worms shall be their bed,
And they shall have no hope of rising from their beds,
Because they do not extol the name of the Lord of Spirits.
[And raise their hands against the Most High],
And tread upon the earth and dwell upon it.
And all their deeds manifest unrighteousness,
And their power rests upon their riches,
And their faith is in the gods which they have made with their hands,
And they deny the name of the Lord of Spirits,
8 And they persecute the houses of His congregations,
And the faithful who hang upon the name of the Lord of Spirits. 

(book of Enoch Chapter 46)

First the book of Enoch is a prophecy about the end times what Enoch saw was to take place in the future not the past

In Chapter One, Enoch is called to prophecy events that will take place in the last generation, in visions given to him by God. In the visions, he describes Jesus' Second Coming with the saints, and the judgment of the unrighteous).

[*And he took up his parable and said "Enoch, a righteous man, whose eyes were opened by God, saw

the vision of the Holy One (God) in the heavens, which the Angels (of God) showed me and from them, I heard everything; and from them, I understood as I saw, but (what I saw, and what I heard was) not for this (my) generation, but for a remote one which is 3.) for to come (in the Last Days)."]

(The generation "for to come" that Enoch alludes to in Verse 3. above is this generation, "Our Generation.

" The generation that will see the climax of all the dreams, visions, insights, experiences and wisdom given to Enoch by God concerning the last generation come to pass).

What Enoch sees or saw in this book is going to take place in the last days he did not see the Son of Man in his own time but in the latter generations when he will return at the end time. But some others understand this and Daniel’s reference to mean that the Son of Man had pre-existence before he was born, but this is not so.

Concerning the Elect (the Redeemed), I (Enoch) said and took up my parable concerning them.

BIBLE REFERENCE: [****MARK 4:10-12 As soon as He was alone, His followers, along with 

the twelve, began asking Him about the parables. 11 And He was saying to them, "To you 

has been given the mystery of the Kingdom of God, but those who are outside, get everything

in parables, 12 so that while SEEING, they may see and not perceive, and while HEARING, 

they may hear and not UNDERSTAND; otherwise, they might return and be forgiven."] NASU

This helps us to understand chapter 46 evidently the son of man is a symbolic figure 

It should be noted that chapter 46 speaks about the pre-eminence of the son of man before the Lord of spirits: 

And whose lot hath the pre-eminence before the Lord of Spirits in uprightness for ever.

48.1 And in that place I saw an inexhaustible spring of righteousness and many springs of wisdom surrounded it, and all the thirsty drank from them and were filled with wisdom, and their dwelling was with the Righteous and the Holy and the Chosen.

48.2 And at that hour that Son of Man was named, in the presence of the Lord of Spirits, the Head of Days.

48.3 Even before the Sun and the constellations were created, before the Stars of Heaven were made, his name was named in front of the Lord of Spirits.

Just says he was named and chosen, doesn't say he actually existed.
We were also chosen before the foundation of the Earth.

Eph 1:4 For he chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world that we may be holy and unblemished in his sight in love. (NET)

Rom 4:17 as it is written, “I have made you the father of many nations”—in the presence of the God in whom he believed, who gives life to the dead and calls into existence the things that do not exist  (English Standard Version)

just look at the context: after saying that his name was named, it is explained:
"He shall be a staff to the righteous...he shall be a light to the Gentiles..." etc. The naming of a thing is the defining of a thing. This is like when Abraham is named a father of many nations before he has a child, and how Immanuel is named before his time. This has to do with God's purposes. Peter also said that God chose him before the foundation of the world, so why would it be a surprise?

Just ask yourself which makes more contextual sense.
For some more idea of how this makes more sense in the first case, look at chapter 71, verses 14-16, where the author is called that son of man.

what is rendered as existence in the one translation pertains to how he was with the Father beforehand, which, in the context, has to do with how he was determined to come into His presence. The Son of Man figure, after all, is based on Daniel, where the Son of Man COMES INTO God's presence --- not that he's created in His presence.

The idea of anachronistic life (pre and post existence) is rife in the Hebrew Scriptures. Reading these in their contexts, any rational minded person should be able to discern symbolic nature of these, often metaphorical, and designed to instill eschatological truths (related to covenantal history). Levi, “being in the loins of Sbraham” when he met Melchizedek is one example (Heb 7:3-10).

Yahweh said to Jeremiah (chapter i, 5): "Before I formed you in the belly I KNEW YOU; and before you came forth out of the womb, I SANCTIFIED YOU: and I ordained you a prophet unto the nations." Now Jeremiah did not exist before his conception. Yet these words would seem to teach it, if understood as those who believe in the pre-existence of Christ, understood the statements about him. As a purpose Jeremiah existed; his person was as clearly present to the divine mind as if he had stood before Him in actual fact. This is the explanation of words, which, rigidly construed, would imply Jeremiah's pre-existence.

The principle of the argument is expressed in the words of Paul (Romans 4:17) "God who quickens the dead, and calls those things which be not (but are to be) AS THOUGH THEY WERE." See also the introductions of the gospel of John and the letter to the Colossians.
"And now, Father, glorify me at your side with the glory I had with you before the world was created . . .you loved me before the creation of the world" (John 17:5,24)
Here our difficulty is to understand how Jesus could have been honoured and loved by the Father before he actually existed as an independent person. The problem really arises from our limited view of time.
To us the passage of time is like a line. Separate events are distinct points on that line. So if we were to indicate the relative places in time of Abraham, Moses, David, Daniel, Christ and the apostles, we should get something like this:

1800 BC . . Abraham
1400 BC . . Moses
1000 BC . . David
600 BC . . Daniel
BC / AD . . Christ
50 AD etc. Apostles

An order of appearance inevitably arises. We cannot think of their place in history in any other way. But this is because of our finite minds. We have no consciousness of the distant past; and none at all of the future.
But the mind of God is not subject to these limitations. His mind is infinite in power. He is just as capable of being conscious of past situations, or of future ones, as He is of the present. So we cannot represent the Divine experience of time by a line. It must be more like the following diagram.

Now we know that Moses did not exist before Abraham, and that David lived about four centuries before Daniel. But in our diagram God is the centre of the arc; He is the same distance from them all. Our "distance" represents God's infinite consciousness. He was just as "conscious" of the sort of person they would each be, long before they were born. He could visualise them, and speak prophetically of them. So the Father knew what sort of person the Son would be before he was actually born and began to exist as a separate person. He could plan what He would eventually accomplish through him. He could "glorify" and "love" in advance His own Son, "the only-begotten of the Father".

As the Apostle Peter put it:

"Christ was foreknown indeed before the foundation of the world, but was manifested at the 

end of the times for your sake" (1 Peter 1:20, R.V.). (The A.V. uses "foreordain" here, but elsewhere translates the same word by "foreknow".)

So too the saying of Jesus to the Jews:
"Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day; and he saw it, and was glad . . . Before Abraham was, I am" (John 8:56-58).

Abraham, having received the promises, looked forward to the coming of the One in whom "all families of the earth shall be blessed" (Genesis 12:3). Jesus knew that he was that One, having priority even over Abraham in God's purpose.